Brewtifully Made

Weaving Art into Community Spaces: A Dialogue with Kari Gray-Hoff on Creativity and Connection

February 09, 2024 Tracy Dawn Brewer Season 2 Episode 6
Brewtifully Made
Weaving Art into Community Spaces: A Dialogue with Kari Gray-Hoff on Creativity and Connection
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As the sun rises on another creative day, I'm joined by the extraordinary Kari Gray-Hoff, whose rich journey in art is as captivating as her designs. Weaving memories of our initial mastermind meet that bloomed into a cherished friendship, we delve into our shared passion for bringing vibrant art into the heart of community spaces. Kari opens up about her transition from product development to her current love affair with pattern design, revealing the inspirations and hurdles encountered in etching her mark on the local art scene. We celebrate the collective spirit of artist cooperatives and the pivotal role of community events in amplifying artists' voices and works, even when times challenge us to think outside the traditional gallery box.

Grab your favorite mug of coffee and settle in for a discussion that traverses the colorful intersection of art, business, and the ties that bind them to our local communities. From the nuances of morning routines that fuel our entrepreneurial spirit to the clever use of social media to spotlight the creative DNA within our families, this conversation is a treasure trove of insights for artists and art lovers alike. Kari and I also peel back the curtain on the delicate art of setting boundaries, the importance of constructive criticism, and balancing the scales of workload through strategic planning. We leave no stone unturned, addressing the artist's need for authentic connections, from homeowners to interior designers, and share our personal anecdotes on nurturing these relationships. Join us and be inspired to weave your own artistic tapestry into the fabric of your community.

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Tracy Dawn Brewer

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Welcome back to Brewtifully Made Happy Friday. I am so super excited because I have my first guest on the program today and she is a dear, sweet friend that I have got to know through a creative endeavor, so I'm going to share all about that. I'm going to be sharing with you a little housekeeping. We are doodling today and we are going to follow Elo Lovey's prompts again and it is a playing card. So that is the prompt for today and I'm excited to draw something fun. And I know my lovely guest, Kari Gray-Hoff, is with me today. Hello, kari.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Hello, thank you so much for having me.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

This was so fun. I know it's very fun. So Kari and I met through the Windows Still Chat Studio shared sessions. That was a mastermind that we both signed up for with Margot Tanto. So, kari, I want to have you share a little bit about your creative history and what led you to sign up for that class.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Well, let's see, I started graphic design in college and when I got out there weren't a lot of great jobs and so I ended up going to work or, at the time, what was a little startup, I went to work for Starbucks and I was basically just do anything that they told me to do, but I did all the store signage and I did marketing and helped with all that kind of stuff, and I've always been creative my family's super creative. My mother has always done everything from scratch. And so a couple years ago, long story short, I got out of the corporate world and decided I wanted to get back into being creative and drawing and painting and all that good stuff. And so in the spring of last year I did Bonnie Christine's immersion and learned Adobe and have started doing pattern design, and which I love because one of my favorite jobs in my career was managing textiles for a retailer and so having a lot of fun with that, but still learning and growing and trying to figure it out.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, and I'm going to just preface this entire conversation that Kari is super, super humble but unbelievably talented. Her sketchbooks and her studio is just fabulous, and we are going to share social media that she has and images of things that she's created, and you're going to be blown away because Kari's based in Kansas City and this conversation is going to surround how do you get your artwork and your creative endeavors out into your community, and I've been doing that a lot here, and so the more that we talk between one another, that topic just kept coming up, and so that's what our conversation is going to be around today, because Kari's work needs to be in your home, like she said, with the textiles and the wallpaper, and it is gorgeous, it is absolutely gorgeous. Again, she is so humble, but it is just fabulous, and so I love that. This is what you want to talk about, kari, because I want to see all of your work in everybody's homes, not just in your area, but all over.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Well, thank you. Yeah, it's. You know, I moved to Kansas City just almost six years ago for work, and I think everybody knows, when you're working full time, it's sometimes hard to meet people outside your sphere, and then the pandemic hit. You know, and we all know, what that did in terms of connection and community. And so this is a topic, theresa, you're so inspiring because I just I'm so blown away by the impact you have on your community and the connections you've made, and so to have this conversation just means so much to me, so thank, you, oh thanks.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

And it's so funny because, Kari, the more we talk and learn about like what we've done, our paths have been down the same way. Like I took Bonnie's class too. I was in the immersion program and I just loved that and I wanted to do more with surface pattern design. I've been on Spoonflower for like 11 years and that was my first like jump into it, not knowing like how to do it, just really just tackling it on my own. So it was great to have that guidance. And then we got to personally meet at Art Biz Jam, because I went and it was in Kansas City and that was so much fun. We had such a blast. Yeah, that was fun, oh gosh. And I love the facts in your community, because then you got to visit a manufacturer and get a little insight on what they're doing and how they work with artists, and you've already had that in your like back pocket. Like you said, you've worked with different product development and things like that. So I love that. You're kind of like kind of rain this in and coming into the community and I think the first thing you have to do is identify those people or organizations or businesses, and so how have you started that in your location? Have you got to reach out to anybody?

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, you know, a couple of years ago, when I was really feeling the tug to get back to kind of my painting, drawing creative roots before I quit working, and I reached out to a couple of artists here in Kansas City and through Margo's Windowsill chats one of them was interviewed and so I was like she's in Kansas City, I'm going to call her. And so I called them and we got together and we met and you know, it's again, it's people are so busy and they have their lives, they have their connections, and so I have found it challenging to kind of keep that going. But through Art Biz Jam, you know, I've met other artists, but you know, so you again, you inspired me. So I signed up for two artists groups here, one based on the Kansas side and, if people don't know, kansas City is split down the middle by state line road, so half of it kind of is in Missouri and half of it is in Kansas. So I signed up for two artists groups, coalitions, if what, yeah, that have community events and classes, and so I'm super excited about that. I signed up for a free photographing your artwork class Through one of them, which is something that baffles me, you know, learning the technology, because you know, when I went to college we didn't have all this stuff.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I know I'm right there with you.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Everything with a hand lettered and hand cut out with the exacto blade. I'm really good at that, so yeah, so that's kind of where I'm starting. It's just making those connections and trying to go to their events and things like that and continuing to try and meet other artists here in the area.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, and I think that Kansas City when I visited, seemed like a very art progressive location. In there, I mean we, I made you go to the library because I was like I didn't even.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I mean, this is this. This is me. I'm terrible. I didn't even know that library was there. That was so fun, so, so I know.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I know because it was all books that I had. It was a beautiful day. I'm like I have to go. Yeah, that was a good one, I just and that's what's so neat is if you kind of step back and take a look at your community as a tourist, through tourist eyes, and get to explore those locations. Those organizations love when you bring your enthusiasm and your passion to them and then that generates other people's interest, because you're not the only one that doesn't know that that was there, you know, and so that awareness is huge. And I think being involved with, like a local chamber or other small business community events, that you can bring your art into a different way to create awareness in your community, are great ways. I love the art organizations and the collaborations that the artists have, but also thinking outside of the box and attending farmers markets or maybe attending my daughter has the best results going to the PTO craft shows. She sells like one thousand to three thousand dollars worth of pottery at the school craft shows. Can you believe that? Oh yeah, she'll create things and take them to these. Like small communities Crash, this is Seattle. This is Seattle. Seattle is huge, but they're always looking for artists to sell things and down to that little niche. I was blown away when she told me that, yeah, and so you know looking at those kind of little markets just to get through the name out Exactly. Oh, quality markets are huge, yeah, yeah. So it's, yeah, you're going down the right direction, getting involved with those collaborations. But also, I know that your pieces, the ones that we have looked through in your lookbooks and your sketchbooks, are perfect for the building industry, with those decorators and anybody that has showrooms with beautiful fabrics, custom when you can create custom pieces for a homeowner. Getting involved with, like a BIA, a building industry association, oh yeah. And then your interior designers and things like that Again, thinking outside of that box and talking to them directly because your pieces are just beautiful for that.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah Well, thank you. Yeah, I have thought about you know talking to individual designers and coming up with kind of a schedule of how you you know the services you know To offer and stuff like that. So yeah, and local community we've got such a great little neighborhood here and kind of a busy community and so I have not reached out to them. So that is a good one, too, to get it on my list to reach out and see if they have anything going on. I'm sure they do. There's always something going on.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, yeah, and especially if you have a rotary I mean, I know we have a couple of those around here too. Yeah, they sound a little passionate, but they're still there, you know, they're still vibrant and part of the business community. Yeah, yeah, that's great. Yeah, those are great ideas, and I know that's what you're thinking about. It's hard as an artist You're creating, but then you have to market yourself and then you have to reach out. I mean, it's like you're this one woman show. It's a lot of work, it really is. It's hard, yeah.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, trying to keep it all going. Yeah, I don't know how you do it.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I work full time and those are really hard. I mean, I can't wait to one day do this full time. Yeah, yeah, I know.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

We're too.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, that's the goal. So it's funny because I went to an art class this weekend. It was a hand lettering class and she's a photographer and she has a studio and then the, I guess, evan Flow of her studio sessions. She holds classes with all different artists and this is wonderful. So if you can find a location to host, like community meetings or workshops and share your knowledge, that's huge. People want to learn. I know I love learning.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I love to continuously learn something. I feel like I don't know that I can teach, though, because I feel like I I'm just I'm I'm not sure I'm a teacher.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Well, start with one of those artists that you spoke with, bring them in and create a studio atmosphere. I mean, you have a beautiful studio, so if your husband's open and your family's open, and to let you you know, do that, you could do that there or you could find a spot.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, my husband will do anything so.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I'm very blessed. But you could have a whole slew of classes and to have visiting artists come and learn their processes and how they're doing it. Yeah, that's what helps generate those ideas. And then you're going to say, oh well, maybe I can show somebody how to create something for a card. Just start with cards, or start with something. Okay, carrie, you shared your gifts for your grand and your family at Christmas. They were beautiful. If you had a class on how to make that memory game, people would eat that up.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, that was, that was a fun little, that was a fun little thing to me for him.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

So yeah, but there is a market for that. Yeah, that's a good idea. I love that.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I once I did for my team at work. I we had a cookie decorating party During the holidays. That was our holiday party. I baked a bunch of cookies and everybody Decorated cookies, so that was kind of fun.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I love that and I know we've talked about looking at nonprofits in the area and I know that you said that you and your family are part of some or interested in joining some Nonprofits and so getting some art together for maybe they're having a fundraiser or an auction. I've done that. I usually try to pick two to four a year and support and that's been huge because I Love being able to participate and I feel like I'm giving back with my time and talent and then I actually have had, you know, commissions after that.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, I love that idea we have. My husband and I support a local nonprofit that supports foster kids in our area and so I Got all excited when, after you and I kind of chatted and got all excited about, oh, I could do a call for artists and a call for submissions and we could have a garden party in our backyard and hang all the art in the porch and there you go.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Oh my gosh, that would be phenomenal. Oh my gosh, they would love that. They would probably flip out if they heard you'd want to do that for them.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah so I don't know, I I loved to entertain, I loved to cook. You know, at one point time my daughter and I had a A little business together I'm doing gourmet food and so I loved to, you know, to put things like that together and make people feel welcome. And so what? What better than to add art to that right?

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Oh, that's perfect. See, you've already got like this whole skeleton built around that.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I just put that in my how I'm my bit, my schedule and trying to launch my business and do that. So again, I'm gonna follow your, your hours and be up at five in the morning and I, I don't want you following a retired bed.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

You know what, you get used to it. After a while you got he's like a burst of energy. I'm just like, oh, I can work in these quiet moments when nobody else is like bothering me and talking to me. That is the best, yeah.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, just stay hydrated. That's that's my lesson here Stay hydrated, definitely, definitely.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

And we're gonna have to sneak a little plug in for your daughter, cat beautiful, take talk, because Talk about an amazing cook and she is in our in and just. I had to follow her as soon as we met and she's phenomenal too. So you do have such a talented family and I love it, thank you, oh gosh, so I love that you're looking at that, building a network that is in your community and Burying the kinds of creative contacts. I think that it helps diversify your. You know avenues of like where your art can fit in and you have that experience and that knowledge of putting it towards marketing and putting it towards a business or putting it towards you know helping and I think that that Is really important to share. So, as you're building your, maybe your website or your portfolio online, showing this is how it applies to you and this is how I can help you by being creative. And it could be a homeowner, it can be a business, it could be a real estate agent, it could be a Interior designer. I think again, thinking outside of, I just want to sell this painting I made because I think artists get stuck in that.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, and you know I, when I was, I was in my studio yesterday and kind of it was a down day for me and I just was trying to be quiet and creating and I was working on something and I had to keep reminding myself that there are no right and wrongs right In art and that there's a place for everything. And you know we all suffer that like, oh, my stuff's not good enough to put out there. Tracy, you know that I am not very good at, or very consistent at, sharing on Instagram. So if anybody goes on my Instagram, there's not very much there but I'm working on it. But my site is has some of my work on it, but it's trying to continue that and to share and create connections. You know what they say to have a friend, you have to be a friend and that's you know. It just takes. It takes a lot of energy and I think you are a role model for that, how you are so supportive of other artists that I mean me and you know our friend Brenda, and you're always there to say, you know, oh, this is fabulous, or do this, or I, if everybody doesn't know, tracy's a computer with too, so I'm like text you help? Oh, oh, my gosh, I'm just doing those answers.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I swear no, karin, you work with both sides of your brain too. She's helping me with spreadsheets and how to organize my store and like what to do with wholesale. And trust me it, this is what. Oh my gosh, it has just been a fabulous collaboration and group that we were in for this mastermind, and just how everybody helps everyone. And you're just making my heart burst. I just love you. You're so sweet. I just have never had this kind of collaboration with artists ever before. I've tried for 23 years to break into this community and I've supported people downtown and the little galleries and it just takes time. And don't beat yourself up over the consistency of social media. Don't let that be a deterrent. Don't be like I haven't posted in a month and I feel crazy putting this on here. Do it. Who cares?

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I know I just figure out how fair I had to continue to do it.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

So yeah, it's a lot of work again.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

It's a lot of work to do that and, as you said, as artists who work for ourselves, even if it's not monetized, it's still so much effort to get out in front and make those connections Because, like you, a lot of people I know and some of the artists that I have met here, they hold down full-time jobs right, and they have families and they have community commitments, and so I know how it feels to like sometimes you're like I just can't. Add one more thing to my schedule. I was talking to a friend the other day and she had friends in town and she's like I'm so tired, I just I can't, I can't, they're in town, they're all, but should I go? I'm so tired and I get that. I know how that feels and so I think you're right Just being consistent and trying to reach out to different groups and people and showing up.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, it is hard, but I think your talent of organization, if you take that and build out a three-month, six-month, nine-month, 12-month view, these are a little bit of my goals and these are people I wanna talk to. And this is maybe you wanna concentrate on different industries in those little segments. Breaking it down. I do that a lot. I write down a lot of things and try to make a plan, and that's. I love being spontaneous with my art, but with the whole side of trying to keep the connections, I have to document it, I have to have checklists and things like that, and you're very good at that, Kari.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

You're so good at that.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I'm a list maker.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yes.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I am too, and it takes somebody's other eyes looking at something, going oh I didn't look at it like that and you've helped me do that, and that's something that we don't apply to our art, our creative side, sometimes, but it does help and, like you said, you get all those ideas going in your head and like I've got to organize this. And so I know that kind of goes towards like doing something on a regular basis and the idea that you'd like to host that nonprofit and contacting different organizations. I think that doing it around seasons or doing them around maybe themes I'm sure your community has things that are going on that have different, I guess, initiatives so taking a broader look at that in your community and working around that, yeah, yeah, it's a good idea.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, different schools and stuff too, maybe. So yeah, I'm not sure. Yeah, yeah, I'll have to look into the local craft show thing.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah we have an organization here called 720 Market and they're curated not juried, but curated shows. So there's not a lot of repetition and there's not a lot of like everything's pretty much handmade, but it's so much fun and they're held in different places, and so that's something you know. I wish I knew Kansas City better to say, like contact this person. I don't, I don't have those connections, but I know that once you start looking in that arena I'm sure you'll be able to. Yeah, those are good ideas of places to look yeah, and this podcast and I mean this is just one way that I could think of talking to people like you, celebrating people I'm meeting and really just getting some of these thoughts out on my head that I know I'm not the only one that's dealing with them, or have them the imposter syndrome that you were talking about. That was a podcast episode. I mean, we are all dealing with it and I just I have felt so alone for so long thinking this is just me. And I'm realizing it's not. So that's what this was for.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, now it's, it's. It is so helpful when you realize that you're not alone, yeah, that others feel this way, and you know, just you saying that it took you so long to break into your community. You know again, you know full-time job and family, and you know, I know you're relatively new to Canton, right? Yeah?

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I mean, I've been here 23 years, Gary, I've been here 23 years.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, I'm saying it was shorter than that, but still yeah, so, yeah. So there you go. It takes a while, I mean.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Cause I'm the. I'm that person that you spoke about, the full-time working artist.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah yeah, and then you know, and then it doesn't help when, when you, when you're like oh, I can't, I'm not ready, that's me. I'm not ready to put it out there yet. I just need to, I just need to tweak it a little bit. I'm not ready to put it out there yet. Yeah.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

So and that's not true. Yeah, it's that perfectionism that we have in the back of our minds that we've been taught or we've heard or we've learned, and I deal with that too, and the older I get, the more I'm like you know what. This is where I'm at and I'm going to share it. Sharing the processes of how you do something is fascinating to people. They want to see how you do stuff and so start sharing. I mean you don't even have to be on camera, just your hands, and it doesn't have to be like a half an hour video 10 seconds of what you're doing, or like what ink you're using, what paint you're using, the pens that you're using, the paper that you're using. It helps others come out of their shell because they're just scared.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

You're so right, those are my favorite ones to watch, right? No, oh, oh, I can write down that color of wash. You know Like, yeah, you do that all the time. I have so many things saved on my Instagram because it's art supplies. Yeah, like I need more art supplies.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

But I'm the same way, though I don't have cast episodes past that I wouldn't use wash because I didn't know how to say it and I didn't want to go to the store. I mean, I did until I learned this is how you say this and this is what it does. And I mean I put it on I think, a canvas once and it peeled right off and like what do you mean? This doesn't stick. What did I do wrong? You just need to share your processes that other people can learn from you.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, yeah and having. I think it goes back to that opening up and being willing to be vulnerable, and you know.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

The whole Brinay Brown syndrome.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was reading a thing this morning Somebody posted about Brinay Brown.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, yeah, if she hasn't empowered women in the last few years, I don't know who else. Yeah, I mean it because it does make you stop and think. And if it's not now, when are you going to do it? If it's not you, who's it going to be? There's no reason it can't be you. There's no reason why you shouldn't try to put your stuff out there. Yeah, you know, design your wallpaper, order some samples and let's see what it looks like, and put it on a wall. And this is how you know I can create this and just, it's not going to hurt a thing. You're trying, just like everybody else, but you're inspiring at the same time, because you're being fearless, and I know you got that in you. Yeah, I don't know why you're scared to share your stuff. It's gorgeous, there's no negativity that could deter you and that's what you got to keep in the back of your mind, yeah, and you know it's so funny because, like I said when I was doing this, right.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I was like. I was like you know, there's no right or wrong in art, it's just art. So whatever comes out of you at that moment is what it is.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Right. I love when people were like learn the rules and then break them. Why, yeah, create your own rule. It's your creativity, it doesn't matter. You know, if this is not a parallel line, that's perfectly straight, that you didn't do and procreate and hold the pen down so it snaps to straight. That's what makes it beautiful the wonkiness and the hand, the handiness of it, you know.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's embracing that, because I think we all see in our mind the way we want something to turn out, and if it doesn't turn out exactly like you had envisioned it, then it's not good. That's where I go. It's not good.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I'm just saying what Start over.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

And or if it doesn't look like, if you're taking a class and it doesn't look like that instructors or other artists style, then you didn't do it right. But there's no, yeah, and that's I mean. That's where I'm starting to come to and that's why I love your attitude of I'm just going to do it Like I don't care what people think. And you know, you talk about Catherine with her TikTok, and I think I've told you this. It's like you can't, you can't, you can't pay attention to the people that make negative, crazy comments. No, just can't, because there's going to be those people out there that just want to be heard, for whatever reason.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

They're not out there making it.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, they're going to. There's going to be crazy negative comments and you just have to ignore those. And you're not doing it to be liked, you're doing it because you have a passion for it. So, right, I've kept myself all the time.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, you're good at talking to other people, and then you've got to start listening to yourself. I know, and you've said that, you know that that's true. Yep, oh my gosh, and it's hard. It's hard to be that for yourself, cause I deal with the same things that I'm like trying to tell you. I'm like, oh, this is a good enough. This doesn't look exactly like this it's, it's, that's right.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I just cherish you because you're that mirror that says, hey, you paid to look, you're fine, you do this, so, yeah, so those you know, those valuable friendships and connections are, are, are just, you know, priceless. Yeah, totally priceless.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, and I just just shocked about the pads that our lives take to find those. Yeah, you know.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, yeah, definitely, and I know that you'll find that in your community. I know that once you start venturing out and making those connections and people realize your talent, it's going to speed up and come quickly and I know you'll be prepared for it. But it gets overwhelming. Yeah, it does get to like. Then they see that you're helping with a nonprofit and then you get bombarded with 10 requests and you're like I can't do all of those or I have to say no. Yeah, and please say no, do not overwhelm yourself, do not get so you know, buried where you're saying and I'm very bad about that, and I'm here, I am telling you that Just to say no, because I'm learning. No, it's hard to. I've had to say no, oh, you're, oh, I've said I. I. I've had to say no a couple times this year because there were quotes that I had put out for jobs two years ago.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Two and a half years ago.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

And they're coming back to me now saying I want to do this and I'm like I can't do it for that price or I don't have time to do that because I said this would be done in a week and I have things now and you know I'm sorry, you know. So people are like start putting expiration dates on your quotes. I'm like I guess I'm going to have to. I didn't think of that, you know. Again another learning thing that has happened organically, because it just didn't even dawn on me that they would hold on to it and then come back and want to do it two years later.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's, that's hard. And then they do, they come back and they want it like. Then they want to negotiate.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

It's like yeah, that's exactly what happened. I'm like you know what? This is a sign I don't want to do this.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Right, right. Well, good for you, because that that is hard. Yeah To to walk away. You know my husband's in construction and he's had some. You know home owners want stuff and he talks to me about some of the things that and I'm like walk away. So I know, yeah, thank you To this right now. Yeah.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

So you have to. That's another. That's another hard lesson to learn, but another difficult thing to stand by. It's just good for your mental health, though you really, you know, don't beat yourself up over it and it no, you have to you have to protect yourself, you have to protect your, your mission and ethos and all of that.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

And yeah, you don't want to hurt anybody's feelings and but.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

I know, and surround yourself with people that you know you can get true, you know, good feedback, Like I could ask my mom how something looks and she'll she'll tell me everything looks great. That didn't help me, you know, I love her to death. But she also will tell me it doesn't look exactly like. It has to be photo realistic for it to be approved, and so. I've learned my lesson, like, okay, I can't because that just messes with me, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's just like, okay, I just, I know you learn, you know who you can go to, right, so Right, oh, kari, this has been great. This has been a great discussion. I hope this helps inspire other people. I do want you to share where people can find your work, so Okay so. Instagram or website, and handles and addresses.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

My Instagram is at Kari K-A-R-I, marie M-A-R-I-E design, and then same website, karimaridesigncom. Perfect.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yes, and I know that you will post when you feel ready to have no pressure ever. Yes, but, yeah, start recording. I've got to help you. Yeah, she can like help you do some of your process stuff, because it is beautiful. I can't wait to share the card that you doodled because it is stunning. Yeah, fine.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Yeah, had some fun with that prompt, so that's a good one.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

Yeah, no. Well, thank you for being my very first guest.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

Oh my gosh, I didn't know you, I was your first.

Tracy Dawn Brewer:

You are, you are. And all the links to your socials and your website will be on the show notes. Oh, you're so sweet. But I am just so blessed to have met you through a windowsill chat, studio sessions and got to meet you in person and hang out and had a blast and I hope that happens again because I just love you so much. You're wonderful. What a planamita. I know. I know we do. We have to. So have a great weekend. Thanks for joining me To and keep me informed on how those community connections are going.

Kari Gray-Hoff:

I will yes, I'm going to share on social. Ha, yes, okay, all right Take care, take care Bye.

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